Article here. The video certainly looks amazing.

OriginOil announces breakthrough one-step process to extract oil from algae without dewatering; clears barrier to algae commercialization

In California, OriginOil announced a breakthrough, one-step process for extracting oil from algae. The company said that its patent-pending process does not require chemicals or significant capital expenditure for heavy machinery, and no initial dewatering is required.

The dewatering of algae and extraction of algal oil has been rated by many sources as the most perplexing barrier preventing the rapid expansion of commercial algal fuels.

A time-lapse video at OriginOil.com demonstrates the technology.

The company’s technology combines electromagnetism and pH modification to break down cell walls, releasing algal oil within the cells. The oil rises to the top for skimming and refining, while the remaining biomass settles to the bottom for further processing as fuel and other valuable products.

The technology will be showcased next week at the National Algae Association meeting in Houston.

These folks may be on to something.  Looks like they are making some serious progress on oil separation.

Hope they can get the cost of algal production under control.

morris1524:

 Looks like they are making some serious progress on oil separation. 

Imagine you have 980 grams of water and 20 grams of algae x 50%/ 1000g of medium. How much energy does it take to Sonic and pH down with CO2 1000g of medium to get 10g of oil? Answer = not cost effective. Each one of those bubbles = energy loss.

morris1524:

  Hope they can get the cost of algal production under control.

  Seperation still doesnt help the fact that simply growing algae is far too expensive currently.

froggy:

Seperation still doesnt help the fact that simply growing algae is far too expensive currently.

That was exactly my point.

froggy:

morris1524:

 Looks like they are making some serious progress on oil separation. 

Imagine you have 980 grams of water and 20 grams of algae x 50%/ 1000g of medium. How much energy does it take to Sonic and pH down with CO2 1000g of medium to get 10g of oil? Answer = not cost effective. Each one of those bubbles = energy loss.

morris1524:

  Hope they can get the cost of algal production under control.

  Seperation still doesnt help the fact that simply growing algae is far too expensive currently.

I disagree.  We are forming a start-up to provide biodiesel to rural areas in southen Asia.  Of all the technologies reviewed, algaculture is the most promising, particularly catalytic flow-through processes for oil separation.  In the venues we are contemplating, govenmental support is a given, obviating traditional cost-benefit analysis.  These folks need energy and if can be produced at the village level, it is all benefit to them.

As a note, I am thrilled to find y'all and these forums.  I have learned so much from your discussions that will directly impact this aspect of our developing project, including showing me some of the high technological hurdles I hadn't anticipated.  Coming from the scientific community but having been isolated from it for years due to an industrial management career, it is so refreshing to my heart and intellect to find like-minded folks.  Thank you!

so wait, did that take one hour or one minute for it to settle?

JGuetz:

I disagree.  We are forming a start-up ...  

  If you are forming a startup to produce algae energy, surely you must have solved this issue that you are disagreeing with. Care to elaborate on that solution?

 

Growing algae is not expensive if done in the proper manner

 in fact it can be very profitable if one folds in value added products into the scheme of things

. in fact the cost of algae can be negligeable as long as high value products are grown concurrently

what remains the stumbling block is the development of inexpensive  oil extraction technology that doesnt take a "rocket scientist" to operate

the equipment costs must be very low and easy to  maintain and operate and the equipment must be very inexpensive

we are dedicated to putting this technology in the hands of as many  people as possible

farmers and people seeking career paths and job opportunities can learn this technology to produce algae for food, feed and fertilizer

forbiofuels from algaeis to happen the challenge of producing a low cost  oil extraction process is tantamount.

in the mean time growing algae for food for animals and humans as well as for fertilizer is a very profitable and  available option. that is redily available  and can serve as a way to learn how to grow algae on a large scale while making money

. and then, once  one becomes experienced with algae growing techniques, then transition from food grade  to fuel grade algae will be just a matter of switching to  high lipid algae and being able to afford the oil extraction equipment

 

 

ecogenics3:

  Growing algae is not expensive if done in the proper manner

 in fact it can be very profitable if one folds in value added products into the scheme of things

. in fact the cost of algae can be negligeable as long as high value products are grown concurrently 

  Ofc this isnt true. If it were and you have been doing it for 30 years, then I would be driving on algae diesel by now. So something must be wrong with the calculations here.

Extraction methods can be easily engineered. There are countless extraction methods that are being done on an industrial scale that could be implemented so I dont buy the argument of

ecogenics3:

what remains the stumbling block is the development of inexpensive  oil extraction technology that doesnt take a "rocket scientist" to operate

because crushing/extraction of oil from beans accounts for less than 10% of the overall cost of all endproducts of beans. This is not a hurtle if there was a large feedstock of algae.

I think you have a flaw in your logic here. How can you have this: 

ecogenics3:

and then, once  one becomes experienced with algae growing techniques, then transition from food grade  to fuel grade algae will be just a matter of switching to  high lipid algae and being able to afford the oil extraction equipment  

  and then have this too?

ecogenics3:

 in fact it can be very profitable if one folds in value added products into the scheme of things

. in fact the cost of algae can be negligeable as long as high value products are grown concurrently  

  Are you saying that all algae are interchangable in your 'value added' chain? If you are, I know you know that is not true. So while you might be able to grow food and create an 'photo bio reactor' that produces a set of results, that doesnt extrapolate that the system will also grow all oil bearing algae and get the same results. Thus, the cost of the value added drops out of the equation.

as usual you are true to form with your constant curmudgeonism.

the fact is that most high lipid algae are used to feed fish therefore the possibility of producing  high value added products is  entirely feasable

if proposing that one can make a good income by growing food grade algae and that by doing so they can learn enough to transist into growing fuel grade algae is not feasable i must ask upon what authority do you challenge what i say?

  Ive often asked you a question that you have never answered. WHAT HAVE YOU DONE? I BET SOMEONE THAT YOU WOULD GO INTO YOUR USUAL TIRADES  i WON THE BET.

 TELL US WHAT HAVE YOU DONE ?

I can plaster these pages with pix of ther hydroponic gardens and tilapia fish and algae blooms along with a good number of the seminar atendees that have seen the system operating first hand . not just laymen but university professors and scientists .where do you come off to keep on incessantly trying to cast aspersions on what we have been doing successfully for over forty years.

I close with the same  unanswered question  WHAT HAVE YOU DONE? in the algae field???

marc

 

 

 

Hello Mark.

I see you are still making extrodinary claims that you cannot backup with any numbers.  When you are called out on your claims you are still losing your temper and screaming out your usual inuendo "What have you done".  Which is clearly not the issue in question.

Over the years you have avoided answering question of production.  Showing irrelevant pictures of hoop houses with ponds incorporated, so few hydroponic plants you couldn't feed 1 person with and 1 sample of a few milliliters of oil.

You try so hard to turn everyones question around onto themselves, thinking that arguing the irrelevant will somehow make the real questions disappear. This  clearly is not the case, as the same questions and issues arise every time you make a unbacked claim.

If you cannot step up to the plate and prove what you claim, back them up with real world proof.  You will continue to be in a perpetual state of frustration arguments and denial.

There will alawys be someone who calls you out on questionable claims. It will never matter what they do, rather it will always be a qestion of what have you realy acomplished? Are you really the athority on the issue?

 

Have a nice day.

 

"Your actions stand over you, speaking so loudly, I can’t hear a word you’re saying."  -- quote from an unknown author

yes my actions do stand  over me louder than my words ..i dont need to say a thing. my words and actions are part of the public record  and the history of biofuels I can truely say.I have produced more results than words. and not just in biofuels but in many fields.

but you cant hear my words or see tmy actions because you are too set in your own  opinionated egotism and arrogance just like froggy. the both of you must be related you are one in the same..

. I won a pretty large bet that you two would spring up when i wrote my last post. we can certainly count on you for a good snicker. you never fail to try to disrupt any thread i appear on, actually you do me a favour. inadvertantly ,as then I have the opportunity to answer and further make my  case for closed loop ecosystems.

 so whatever your intention, im sure that theres  enough transparency behind your disruptions that intelligent people can see through your silliness and petulance.

Ill bet that  If god himself made a positive case for algae culture, (which he has by creating algae for our use and the planets benefit) im sure that you two would leap at the opportunity to argue against his intentions.

yes we grow high value herbs not food, although we do have tomatoes and some lettuces and have experimented with fruit trees within the biosphere  for our own table but they are not as valuable as the basil, and other culinary and medicinal herbs we grow.we get enough for opur own needs theres not much space to hang hydroponic tubes on the railings in our system as we have limited space here it logical that the more space the more product would be produced.

as it is..... we grow thousands of tilapia in a mixed sex environment in order to produce organically certified fish emulsion fertilizer which we sell at premium prices to the organic growers, a specialty niche market..and an extremely profitable one at that, we even make biodiesel from the fish oil that results when making the emulsion.

 if we were to grow tilapia for food, we can grow one pound of fish per gallon of water evry six months that would be close to 65 thousand pounds of fish ....at the rate of one lb. of tilapia per gallon of water which is the accepted and published  production volume for tilapia in an intensive aquaculture environment..

we are a research and development entity not commercial growers,  our closed loop system is 20ft wide and eighty ft long. with a six ft deep pond. it has served us as a proof of concept system as well as a training aid. and that was   and is its only purpose and intention.

at one time we produced ten gallons of ethanol per hour 24/7/365.  we also grew duroc jersey hogs and used the effluent from our digestor to feed the algae pond. the original intention was to use the algae for bioremediation of waste streams. our purpose is to train farmers and interested individuals on algae and tilapia fish production this in order to create income producing  alternative crops  as well as career paths for people seeking new opportunities.

anyhow my work and track record stands for itself you are as annoying as a house flies hovering around waiting to be swatted.

why dont you two get a life!!!

marc

ecogenics3:

    if proposing that one can make a good income by growing food grade algae and that by doing so they can learn enough to transist into growing fuel grade algae is not feasable i must ask upon what authority do you challenge what i say?  

   Because I dont see an Ecogenics food and fuel station on my block, in my local villa or anywhere on the planet for what I can tell.

You said its viable, you have been doing to for 30 years. We have heard it over and over again. Yet, Im sitting here with my empty oil can waiting to pump algoil into it. You said its viable, am I just driving by the algoil stations by mistake? What are we all missing? I mean, you say this, '

ecogenics3:

I can plaster these pages with pix of ther hydroponic gardens and tilapia fish and algae blooms along with a good number of the seminar atendees that have seen the system operating first hand . not just laymen but university professors and scientists .where do you come off to keep on incessantly trying to cast aspersions on what we have been doing successfully for over forty years.

   but where is the 'beef'. 30 years, now its 40 years, it seems to grow 10years/year but however long its been, where are the results of all of these classes? If its all so great and fantastic and has been great and fantastic for 40 years, why isnt there an Ecogenics food and fuel station on my block? You say it works. You say scientists and laymen and university professors have all been taught. Great. Where can I drive up to my first fill up. Heck, Id even pay 25% mark up and buy a 'I buy my algoil @ Ecogenics' sticker to put on my car. So... where is the disconnect? Is it not viable or am I driving past your stations?

By the way, Ive told you who I am. Im a nobody. I have done nothing. Im dumb as a box of rocks and only a 'crumudgin'. Over and over again Ive told you Im nothing, smaller than a pea. Im just a potential customer asking questions. Im curious if you treat all your potential customers like this? Maybe your right, maybe it is viable to make algoil on my block but because anyone that might have a questions will get the royal 'what have you done to question my authority' speech, we would all rather go buy from Exxon. Im not the one spouting off all these claims, Im just questioning them. I was under the impression that we are supposed to question authority.

Marc your irrelevant verbal diarrhea just proved everything I said.

I rest my case.

froggy,

 we dont have any interest in having Ecogenics gas stations anywhere

 we have however proposed logistical concepts regarding distribution of biofuel stations and concepts regarding the Energy Hiway, Something which others are putting into practice.

 what we do evry day of the year is provide high quality  algae cultures at a reasonable cost to aspiring algae growers , researchers and farmers all over the world.

 we also train and educate laqrge groups  and when asked to do so individuals from  virtually evry corner of the earth in fact its hard for me to keep count on how many seminars regarding alternative energy weve conducted over the years but i its one heck of a lot,

 our training manuals are in use all over the world we maintain correspondence with hundreds of people a month answering questions and advising growers.and students even young kids

it was  P.J. my vp who brought up the fact that it has been thirty years here in the usa and ten years before that in mexico that we have been growing algae and tilapia fish.and being involved in alternative energy

 we have over thirty five examples of our closed loop ecosystems around the united stateand other countries. we maintain confidentiality agreements with those who have our systems.. upon request we do not reveal names of those who own our systems. some are operating as designed and some have been turned into hedonists dreams and equipped with lap pools and quadraphonic sound systems as well as growing koi instead of tilapia.but most still grow  edible algae for thier  needs. beautiful little pleasure palaces..one client even took cedar siding and covered a large part of the system with it and built his home in the structure... his dining room overlooke the pond in which he grows koi and some tilapia as has tropical plants abounding this mini biosphere is separated from his  dining room by a glass sliding door.. most of my clients are extremely private and built these systems for thier own pleasure and to do a bit for the environment by having one of these systems as a gesture of thier concern for the global ecology and environment. most of these  folks are extremely affluent and did this for the symboliic support of enviromentalism and for the  pleasure of having a mini rainforest and pond for thier own joy and that of thier friends. they take pleasure in catching some tilapia and spirulina algae on occasion and serving them to thier friends. Ironically this was far from the intent I had in mind for these systems and yes there are some farmers who have built them also but wether it is for the pleasure of having your own mini rainforest and natural setting or to grow fish for themselves or thier friends it matters not. personally i wish they were all farmers or people seeking a way to make a micro enterprise to support themselves.. as to my own ecosystem ive lost count as to how many visitors and students weve had visit our facility. and we have more coming.

  sombody was poopooing my system by saying that there are many others doing the same thing. Yes I say Great! halleluia!  imitation is the greatest form of flattery and yes we were doing fthis forty years ago in fact my ranch in mexico would have remained a derilict memory of the days of the conquistadores had it not been for the fact that i turned it into a dynamic and productive agro industrial complex thanks to my installing   alcohol fuel, methane, gasification and algae-tilapia as well as growing 5000 head of registered Duroc jersey top hogs and registered aberdeen angus cattle

I stocked my reservoir with  spirulina algae from lake texcoco as well as tilapia from the same lake and i let the local inhabitants come on weekends to catch all the fish they wanted and eat all the algae they wanted in a fiesta like atmosphere .. this instilled a great friendhip and comradeship with the natives of the area, it was a beautifull time  and experience in my life.

 unfortunatly the peacefull and productive atmosphere was ruined by marxist lennist and maoist insurgents and mexico is now not a peacefull and beautifull place thanks to them and the drug cartels. in fact what is happeniong there is much like what happened in rhodesia and south africa.

any how think what you want it matters little to me we are firmly imbedded in the field of alterantive energy and algae culture as well as many other alternative technologies with countless buildings of all sizes and design developments in other fields of industrial design. and we have physical proof or each and evry claim that we make not only here in the U.s but all over the world. sorry that doesnt sit well with a few of you.

marc

Marc,

Have you ever considered a career in poletics? You have an amazing gift of avoiding topics and averting peoples focus of the topic at hand.

froggy:

JGuetz:

I disagree.  We are forming a start-up ...  

  If you are forming a startup to produce algae energy, surely you must have solved this issue that you are disagreeing with. Care to elaborate on that solution?

Froggy:

Interesting agitations, you certainly know which buttons per person.

To address you query - and I must apologize in advance, I don't nearly have the word capability or background of Ecogenics3 so this response will be abbreviated in comparison - perhaps in your haste to respond you failed to notice the key concept, the obviation of traditional cost/benefit analysis due to governmental subsidies in the venues where our technologies will be applied.  Without going too far, I think that I can safely say that the benefit yield contains factors not typically monetarily valuated except in a tertiary, downstream, historical analysis.  Relative to bio-diesel harvesting technologies, the state of the art and research is providing methods suitable to our needs; self-contained, easily idiot-proofed, minimal maintenance and durable.

Relative to our mission - and again an apology, I have to be vague but will not be disingenuous - the true innovation we are building upon is a paradigm shift from conventional contemplation of energy issues.  At the point that I can be more forthcoming, I will.  Presently we are just extremely appreciative of the confluence of entities, needs and ideas that will make this project successful and, of course, profitable.

 

JGuetz:

  Interesting agitations, you certainly know which buttons per person. 

  Oh if there was only an olympic sporting event in it

JGuetz:

I must apologize in advance, I don't nearly have the word capability or background of Ecogenics3 so this response will be abbreviated in comparison

Few do.

JGuetz:

  perhaps in your haste to respond you failed to notice the key concept, the obviation of traditional cost/benefit analysis due to governmental subsidies in the venues where our technologies will be applied.  Without going too far, I think that I can safely say that the benefit yield contains factors not typically monetarily valuated except in a tertiary, downstream, historical analysis.  Relative to bio-diesel harvesting technologies, the state of the art and research is providing methods suitable to our needs; self-contained, easily idiot-proofed, minimal maintenance and durable.

  No I didnt fail to notice this. What I fail to see is a way to actually make it happen. But like I said, Im as dumb as a box of rocks and that is why I ask probing questions. 

I have no doubt that you will get

JGuetz:

  governmental subsidies 

and lots of

JGuetz:

  confluence of entities, needs and ideas 

and I hope the best for you to

JGuetz:

  make this project successful and, of course, profitable.  

. My piece of advice is not to tenderly love your project but to do everything you can to scuttle it. When the project is still standing after you, I and everyone else takes their best cracks at it from every angle... then you will really have something. Greg Mitchelle says the same thing in his talk if you dont want to hear it from me.

I totally and vehemantly do not agree with froggy.

here are my tenents for success

 do not waver.. be single minded and resolute in your endeavours.

 study hard all the possibilities and be meticulous in your planning and design work.

beleive in yourself and your concept but think it out carefully systematically consider evry consequence that may ensue

if something doesnt work go back and make it work it it still doesnt work ,go back again untill it does.

never take no for an answer.

accept the fact that the odds are against you

 dont fear

adapt. improvise and overcome.

trust yourself chances are you are right more often than you are wrong.

 study all the possibilities

trust your self

be wary of others.think as if you were alone and if you are not ,count your blessings that you have people around you that are like minded .....but stay alert

if people  around you are not like minded, then look deep into your intuitive self, examine evry detail , go back to the drawing board look at evry detail again and again untill your intuition tells you you are right

 eat sleep and breathe your dream

 the human mind is infinite... follow your intuition

 think think think evry detasil out and then think it out again.

love what you do passionatly become insanely in love with a good idea if you have one

if its not ,then come up with another idea and love it just as passionatly as the one before it.

trust yourself but study evry detail about what you are attempting.

 do not be afraid to stand out

have no fear of failure just go back to the drawing board and think things out.as many times as it takes untill you succeed.

dont fear criticism.. meet it head on agressively and with impugnity

if you are convinced that you are right,,, chances are that you are.

please yourself and you loved ones before you try to please others. chances are they will never be pleased especially if you are successfull. then get ready for innuendo and derision most people hate overachievers.

decide what your goal is.. popularity or success and acheivement

when you reach your goals set new ones to attain.

never question your ambition, go for it!

every human being has great potential but not evry human being can recogniose it or attain it.

dont fear, pray a lot ..  the lord is there to hear you out. if what you are doing is righteous, he will stand with you

 always be righteous

dont equate success with money some of the greatest achievers never made money,

 mainly because that was not what drove thier ingenuity or ambition

making something work was what drove them

money should never be the objective ,,, the common good should be

if you succeed then take real care and play your cards close to the chest.

there are more wolves and sharks then there are benevolent souls.

 reveal enough of your ideas to spark interest never release all the information to anyone,even patents are made to be plagerised they are no protection from idea thieves.

always have a good attorney for council. and keep one on your staff if you get to the ponit where you have an organisation.make  sure you can trust him if not get another untill you feel good about him.

Ive been screwed so many times i need a manhole to cover my ass. so take the above seriously

you will avoid a trail of tears if you do...

 Marc

 

 

if you are looking for friends the business world is not where you will find them

 

ecogenics3:

   I totally and vehemantly do not agree with froggy. 

   I assume Marc means my quote of not loving your project to much. Ofc this was pretty much a direct quote from Dr Mitchell from the video I linked. And because it was a direct quote of his, Marc must 'totally and vehemantly do not agree' with Dr Mitchell. A senior fellow @ the Scripps Oceanography Inst with over 50 peer reviewed publications under his belt, countless grad students and directs 10's of millions of research $'s to the study of turning algae into products. Here is his Bio to look him up.

Im curious why do you think he said that Marc?